Live24wheel's 4.7 Build

[live24wheel]

So im starting my build thread here, I will try and keep the thread updated with a good amount of pictures and what not. The Jeep it will be going into is a 2000 XJ, built with long travel and all the offroad goodies. I just swapped a manual (AX-15) into it the last time I was home. I will only get a chance every month or so to update it with new pictures as thats the only time I get to come home and see the thing! Here Goes...

Recipe:
1997 XJ Motor
.20 Removed From Deck
4.2L 4cwt Crankshaft
4.0L Piston Rods, Polished
KB IC944 .060 Pistons w/Moly Rings
ARP Bolts
CompCams 68-231-4
Crower Cam Saver Lifters
Rollermaster Timing Set
2000 Intake off Current Motor
Mopar Performance Springs, Locks and Retainers
Pioneer Brass Freeze Plugs
MP Head Gasket
Clevite Cam and Main Bearings
Melling Oil Pump Non HV
Fully balanced


This is the core motor I picked up for $25. Had a hole through the number 2 piston, basically a complete short block...


This is the core crank, got it for $75 I think, it was standard and in good shape...


Heres the naked block before it went into the oven... Didn't get any after pictures but WOW, it looked like a BRAND NEW block when it came out...


Here it is after a coat of black engine enamel, brass freeze plugs and the crank installed... That leaves me with a question, the only torque specs I could find for the main bolts was 80 ft/lbs. Sound right?


Roller Master Timing Set...



All of the machine work is done, i got the rods and pistons back as well, will get pictures next time i'm home. I'm waiting to hear on the rod bearings, the machine shop got the Clevite bearings but as expected did not have the provisions for the oil holes. They are trying to get the Federal Mogul ones that should have the provisions but they called one of there suppliers and it sounds like they no longer have the oil holes.

[live24wheel]

Now this has me bugged a bit, I got this cam (Comp 68-231-4) from Summit. As you can see, there is a large pit in one of the lobes. I wont be able to do anything about it until I get home again. Let me give you a quick run down on how I will be using the jeep, I want to be able to have alot of low end torque, basically let the clutch out if 1st/low range and be able to idle over anything. I also want it to scream, I run it hard throug whoops and washes so it sees high RPM. This has me kind of twisted about COMP after all the failures I have read. I saw that pit before I even pulled the cam from the box. I didn't even look at the other lobes. Looks like pretty poor quality control to me.... Any other cams you can recomend me? I was thinking about calling Hesco and seeing what they could offer me, there $'s sure are up there though.

[lafrad]

Unfortunately, you won't get low RPM, Stump pulling torque, and high RPM screaming HP from the same cam.

Best way to accomplish BOTH of those, would be to spec a custom cam, with a moderate intake duration, and a LARGE LSA. 210 deg of 0.050 intake duration with a 115 or 116 LSA will bring your Idle up, and level out the torque from idle to peak RPM... but you WILL LOOSE the "peak torque" and "Peak Hp" numbers. Install it around 112-114 ICL (2 to 4 deg advanced). The "LSA Increase" basically turns your Dyno Graph from a "mountian" to a "hill"... higher on the sides, but less on the peak. Be careful not to go too far with it, because overall operation starts to suffer with the reduction of overlap.

[live24wheel]

I guess what I am looking for is a good stock replacement. Right now I think the stock cam would work great but I won't be reusing the stock com so I will need to buy a new one. My crawl ratio is pretty low so it won't take gobs of torque to get the tires moving at idle. So basically, recomendations for a good stock replacement for my current setup? Or should I try and get another 231-4? Pretty hesitant to get another Comp, but that is what I built my numbers around as well.

Right now I am looking at an aprox. SCR of 9.71 and a DCR of 8.47 with a quench of .051 with the CC 68-231-4...

[lafrad]

Just get a new stock cam from the parts counter at your dealer then (with lifters). it will have the nice, wide lobes and will run * perfectly* with stock springs... saving you money all around.

The ported head, increased compression and increased displacement will do their job on bumping HP and torque across the range.

[live24wheel]

Well I just called the dealer and even with our Jeep Club discount it is more expensive for a stock replacement than going with a Hesco. Also I already have the Mopar springs, retainers and locks. I talked to Bennie and he recommends the RVOB6. He said it should offer everything I want for this motor. It is important for the motor to be reliable and hopefuly have many trouble free miles in its life. I asked about the distributor gear deal as that was my main concern I have about there cams and he said most issues are installer error, or having the the oiling setup wrong, improper pump pressure, etc. Being that I have a 2000 it is distributorless but it still runs the cam sensor on that gear. Any input? I noticed Silver was asking about that cam as well. Is there much of a history of hesco cams whiping out the lobes as some of the other big name cam companys?

Thanks

[SilverXJ]

I asked about the distributor gear deal as that was my main concern I have about there cams and he said most issues are installer error, or having the the oiling setup wrong, improper pump pressure, etc.

The only failure i have heard of on the distributor gear is dur to a HV oil pump or something going on with the position of the dis gear relative to the cam gear.

Being that I have a 2000 it is distributorless but it still runs the cam sensor on that gear.

The distributor isn't what actually loads the gears. It is the oil pump. So the difference between a dis and teh cam sensor doesn't make any difference.

I noticed Silver was asking about that cam as well. Is there much of a history of hesco cams whiping out the lobes as some of the other big name cam companys?

With the number of strokers hesco has made and the cams they have sold I have only heard of two cam problems from them. One was shoeboy's with the dis gear and 1bolts with a bad lobe.

[live24wheel]

I think my main concern with the cam is its ability to work at an idle. I tried explaining my uses to bennie but I beleive he may have misunderstood me. He kept pressing the fact that all the JeepSpeed guys run that cam. Granted my Jeep will go fast, we have alot of rocks and it sees alot of crawling. Input?

[SilverXJ]

Advance the cam then.

[amcinstaller]

i just cant believe how much difference in that crank! every time i look at this thread it astounds me

[SilverXJ]

i just cant believe how much difference in that crank! every time i look at this thread it astounds me

How so?

[amcinstaller]

so rusty and brown at first, then gets so shiny and new looking. i wouldnt have given that crank a second look. looks good in the block though, and the machine shop did some good work gettin it engine worthy i suppose.

[live24wheel]

Yes, I am very pleased with the machine shop I finally decided to go with, only took 3 tries. Just small things like walking me around the shop and showing me the equipment and how it works to introducing me to the guys that work there. The prices were great and included in the price i can take them any brackets or sheetmetal from the build and they will clean it for free. They went above that, they glass beaded all the aluminum parts, the damn timing cover looks brand new! Lol then they have been trying to find me a set of rod bearings with the oil holes. Well they ordered all they could find and none of them have the provisions, so he is going to add them at no extra charge because he told me in the begining it wouldn't be a problem to find them. He wasn't joking when he said the price we discuss and what is on the bill is exactly what I will pay. One of the few good businesses left in Phoenix that seems to care for their customers.

[live24wheel]

Ok just got the Hesco RVOB6 cam ordered. I ran the numbers and it is going to lower my compresion quite a bit. I plan to degree it some. I have read a few guys advanced it 4 degrees and are happy with it. Not sure exactly what I will do.... Heres the new numbers... I need that tourque at idle for crawling but want it to rip some. Not to mention on the freeway im turning some RPM. im at 33's, with 4.56's and an AX15. Maybe I should just advance it 2 degrees? Hell idk, whats yall's input?

0 degrees - SCR 9.78, DCR 7.83
4 degrees advanced - SCR 9.78, DCR 8.06

[SilverXJ]

I've heard that people prefer it advanced as well. If I do get one I would advance it 2 or 4 degrees, not sure though. What fuel are you looking to run though?