Modern EFI (Holley Terminator) installation made simple-ish

[RJTimmer]

I started this project about 6 years ago with a serious case of pissed off. While on trip to Moab in 2017, i had a few issues with my rig...
The trip started out with a Broken rear locker (easy fix, but still very annoying) on day 1. On day 2 my Jeep backfired and stalled on Hells Revenge, and would not start. Thank goodness it was up on top a falt section of slab near Mickeys, or it would have been far more annoying to diagnose. Diagnosis - Bad Crank Sensor. Installed spare. She started and ran, but not good. Day 5, went out to start the old girl after breakfast... she sputtered to life slowly, then stalled at Campsite. Would not restart. Trip over. Missed out on the plast 3 days of wheeling.
Prognosis after diagnosis at home, a bad ICM. I waited 3 weeks for one to arrive at the local Napa. If that had happened day one, I would have been out the entire trip.
I have since fought slow start/long cranking, and cannot for the life of me get it running well, or starting as quickly as is did before. Yes, i did run through ALL of the applicable items in "Crusier54 True Tales from the Book" for the renix system. I even built an entirely new wiring harness, then replaced all the sensors with known working units... no change. Fuel Pressure = GOOD, all injectors were swapped one at a time. no change. It still runs, but feel way down on power, and is not as lively as it once was. I yanked the now over 20 year old stroker out and found NOTHING wrong internally. It was clean and just a loose as i built her back in the early 2000's.



It sucks to have old techonoly that had less than a 1% saturation rate for use in vehicles 30 years ago. Parts are getting harder to find, and are very expensive when you do find them. It also sucks to have EFI you cannot fine tune to your particular engine. It sucks to not have the diagnostics as easily as the OBD2 vehicles (yep, my stroker ran the Renix), that can readily tell you where to look for the root of the issue at hand.

These challenges are what pushed me down the road I am on now; Installing modern and readily available sesnors/parts, and a largely supported aftermarket ECU into my Stroker. I used the following questions to guide my search...
- What are the most common engines in North America? The LS of course, if not on top of this group, its right up there.
- What engine family is the undisputed engine swap king of the world? The LS
- What engine has the most aftermarket support? The LS
- Who has one of the most user friendly and easily confugurable EFI systems out there? Holley.
- What EFI system has the largest user base? Holley
(You all seeing a pattern here)
So that began this project, use as many OEM/OEM replacement LS family sensors as possible, and tie that to the Holley Terminator X series EFI systems.

[RJTimmer]

The subsequent posts will walk my adventrues after choosing the Holley Terminator X system, to where i am today. After securing all the required Terminator compaticble LS sensors, i went to work designing the parts i would need.



I Started with a Throttle Body, Intake, and related items.
I am using GM12586790 & GM 10379038 for the actual TB & TP. These obviously do not directly bolt to the intake, but i can buy them at the O'Riellys down the road... so they fit the build criteria.

Step 1, design & manufacture TB Adapter (87mm bore)


Step 2, Modify Intake (in this case, i will be using the Renix intake. But this adpater fits up to modified HO intakes too.


Step 3, Mount TB...


From here i moved on to injectors, fuel rail, clamps, fuel pressure sensor and wiring harness. The pictures show an HO intake from an O1 iirc. But again, the same TB & Adapter works on both series intakes, once modified.
Step 1, Layout and machine Fuel Rail
I did not take mfg picutres of the FR... sorry... When i make Rev 2 i will be sure to take some.

Step 2, Design, machine, and stall Clamps


Install Injectors, Rail, and FP Sensor adaptor and fitting. I used a piece of #10 fuel rail extrusion and a parker hydraulic fitting to make the rail and sensor fitting. (Shown on HO Intake)


Modify Holley LS Injector Harness, Install IAT and MAP Sensors in modified intake. (I need to finish modifications to the harness to clean it up. This will not be done until i have this assembly migrated to my jeep, off of the test engine)




This covers the intake, and related sensors and actuators... On to the CKP and CPS....

[RJTimmer]

CKP & CPS

These were a trick... I orginally wanted to use an LS Crank Sensor, and will continue to shoe horn one in there. THe problems arose with the off angle bracket, and the main body diameter. I was not able to cleanly and conveniantly mount it into the factory CKP location. The other issue that came up was the OEM Jeep reluctor pattern. None of the OEM patterns are congruent with the options available with the Holley Terminator EFI systems. So... time to make a reluctor...

Step 1, Find a sesnor that works... (12m prox switch, readily available and inexpensive from an industrial automation supply company. I used a gear tooth speed sensor with a 5-30 v operating range. Added the appropriate connector and there we have it.. For the reluctor, i went with a 60-2 format, modfied an OEM Flywheel, and pressfit the reluctor on in the appropriate orientation.


Step 2, Laid out the sesnor location, made up a mount to bolt directly into the OEM CKP holes.


Step 3. CPS. I chose NOT to use the OEM CPS for this engine, because what better place to carry a spare CKP, than in the CPS... (I have proved that the OEM CPS does work with the terminator ECU, but it needs an adapter to get to the holley harness. This set up does use the OEM Jeep CPS Base & Oil Pump Drive from a COP ignition 4.0.



Now for the little things... CTS, OPS, O2, Coils & Mount, and Knocks. These are all fairly easy, with simple adapters for the OPS and CTS, and a fairly easy bracket that is in process for the coil mount. Once i get the Coils mounted up, i will post pictures of that.




I hope to get the Fuel Pump Module set up and wired this week, as well as powering up the ECU and verifying all the other wiring and sensor function. Afterwhich, i am hoping some of you can help me out. I am looking for base AFR and Ignition timing tables based on manifold pressures for these little I6's. I am less optimistic about finding someones aftermarket 4.6 stroker tables, as i am for finding a set of OEM tables for the HO engines. However, i will take what ever i can find. even if they are screenshots of other systems, or if by chance someone has Holley IFC's from a sniper install.


My base engine is .06 over, ported Renix head, Crane Cams (RV Torqure maybe) Advertised Duration 260°/272° @.050 204°/216° .456/.484 lift, 9.2 static compression with dished pistons.

Any one have anything that may be useful for this as a base/starting point? I am NOT a tuner, and this is my first go-round with stand alone EFI. I have played around with "flash" programmers and the ol "trick the ECU with resistors" things.. but they are nothing compared to what will have to happen here.


Also, if any of you would be interested in any of these pieces i made for your own project. Reach out to me via DM or email.

[RJTimmer]

alright... being my photohosting skills are abismal, and i seem to not be able to edit my post...

Lets try this again..

Design it


TB Adapter


Modifing Renix Intake


DWB TB on Renix Intake



Fuel Rail Clamps


Injectors, Rail, FPpsi adapter & sensor, Inlet fitting, injector harness (modified holley LS), IAT, and MAP




Post 3
60-2 Reluctor on FLywheel


CKP Sensor & Mount on Bellhousing in hactory location


CPS & Cap


CTS, OPS



Now that i have that fixed up.....

[2grimjim]

Nice CAD work. Is this running yet?

[2grimjim]

CKP & CPS

These were a trick... I orginally wanted to use an LS Crank Sensor, and will continue to shoe horn one in there. THe problems arose with the off angle bracket, and the main body diameter. I was not able to cleanly and conveniantly mount it into the factory CKP location. The other issue that came up was the OEM Jeep reluctor pattern. None of the OEM patterns are congruent with the options available with the Holley Terminator EFI systems. So... time to make a reluctor...

Step 1, Find a sesnor that works... (12m prox switch, readily available and inexpensive from an industrial automation supply company. I used a gear tooth speed sensor with a 5-30 v operating range. Added the appropriate connector and there we have it.. For the reluctor, i went with a 60-2 format, modfied an OEM Flywheel, and pressfit the reluctor on in the appropriate orientation.


Step 2, Laid out the sesnor location, made up a mount to bolt directly into the OEM CKP holes.


Step 3. CPS. I chose NOT to use the OEM CPS for this engine, because what better place to carry a spare CKP, than in the CPS... (I have proved that the OEM CPS does work with the terminator ECU, but it needs an adapter to get to the holley harness. This set up does use the OEM Jeep CPS Base & Oil Pump Drive from a COP ignition 4.0.



Now for the little things... CTS, OPS, O2, Coils & Mount, and Knocks. These are all fairly easy, with simple adapters for the OPS and CTS, and a fairly easy bracket that is in process for the coil mount. Once i get the Coils mounted up, i will post pictures of that.




I hope to get the Fuel Pump Module set up and wired this week, as well as powering up the ECU and verifying all the other wiring and sensor function. Afterwhich, i am hoping some of you can help me out. I am looking for base AFR and Ignition timing tables based on manifold pressures for these little I6's. I am less optimistic about finding someones aftermarket 4.6 stroker tables, as i am for finding a set of OEM tables for the HO engines. However, i will take what ever i can find. even if they are screenshots of other systems, or if by chance someone has Holley IFC's from a sniper install.


My base engine is .06 over, ported Renix head, Crane Cams (RV Torqure maybe) Advertised Duration 260°/272° @.050 204°/216° .456/.484 lift, 9.2 static compression with dished pistons.

Any one have anything that may be useful for this as a base/starting point? I am NOT a tuner, and this is my first go-round with stand alone EFI. I have played around with "flash" programmers and the ol "trick the ECU with resistors" things.. but they are nothing compared to what will have to happen here.


Also, if any of you would be interested in any of these pieces i made for your own project. Reach out to me via DM or email.

Full throttle timing should be around 32°-34°from 2,000rpm up to redline. Base timing at Idle around 10°-12°. Part throttle you can add 10° or more (45° total) depending on elevation/barometric pressure, fuel octane, etc.

Oh, and toss the stock spark plugs if they are the hideous 10mm projected tip. They're great for inducing detonation/pinging. Go with a plug with a normal extended tip.

[RJTimmer]

I have this running since mid March (2024)... Its been fantastic, even with an unoptimized tune. Im still working on drivability items like cold and hot start, Acceleration Enrichments, etc. Most likely it will go to a professional tuner yet this year for a tweak on the HP/Tq #'s. but all in, i am super happy with the results.

[RJTimmer]

Oh, and toss the stock spark plugs if they are the hideous 10mm projected tip. They're great for inducing detonation/pinging. Go with a plug with a normal extended tip.

I have been running NGK BKR5ES plugs with great success for years now. very little projection into the chamber

[extremetownie]

Would you consider building me an intake?

[RJTimmer]

Would you consider building me an intake?

Absolutely. check your private messages for my contact info.

[RJTimmer]

Nice CAD work. Is this running yet?

I have roughly 50 hours ofdependable run time it now. I wish i would have tackled this project years ago, instead of waiting. The tune still needs to be optimized for max hp/torque, but drivebaility is great The plugs look just a tad rich after long WOT or idle periods so i know im close and not over lean anywhere. No issues with spark knock at all running ethanol free 88 octane.

THings i do not like. My Coil mounts could be stouter, my wiring under the dash could be cleaner, and the fuel pump is noisy. I need to work on stall prevention tables to help with technical drivability in the rocks. Its a touch touchy in low range 1st gear, I have a tendency to low rev and ride the clutch so i dont break axles or Ujoints, and with the huge 87mm throttle body it needs a much more gradual throttle ramp and i need to work on the timing and AE/map tables to have teh ECU better manage idle speeds, which will make the techincal crawling much easier.

[smdellin]

I just ordered a Holley Terminator for my 2005 4.0, plans are to stroke and turbo it this summer. The 2005 is in a 1989 YJ.

I'm glad to see the CPS will work as is, do you know if the stock 2005 crank sensor will work or will I need to fab up a reluctor also? If so what would you charge to build me one?

[RJTimmer]

I did not investigate using the stock crank trigger, and reluctor as the trigger counts did not match one of the prescribed setups in Terminator. I decided to go with the gear tooth sensor and 60-2 reluctor set up for as fine of timing resolution i could get.

I would be happy to supply compoenents or a kit for each application. Send me an email, and we can talk details and cost.

[email protected]

[RJTimmer]

I just ordered a Holley Terminator for my 2005 4.0, plans are to stroke and turbo it this summer. The 2005 is in a 1989 YJ.

I'm glad to see the CPS will work as is, do you know if the stock 2005 crank sensor will work or will I need to fab up a reluctor also? If so what would you charge to build me one?

send me an email, and we can figure out the best solution for your system.