M90 supercharger on 4.6 stroker

[Zorm]

Have a line on two M90 superchargers, one complete with a intercooler. Would it be worth my while to look into this. My stroker is going in a 83 cherokee, using OB1 system. Want to get the adj MAP sensor, working on getting an external FPR and wide band 02 sensor. So would this be something worth doing? I believe I am at 9:1 comp. I am also working on a 68-70mm TB for my stroker and thought the supercharger would be good. I know I may need to get even larger injectors, right now I have 24lb.
Been looking at a few threads on a few web sites for doing this on a just a 4.0 with good - poor results.

thoughts?

[ruffy01]

You've seen Chris's (SilverXJ) thread Here?: http://www.jeepstrokers.com/forum/viewt ... f=8&t=3533

[SilverXJ]

I would get it. The stock map, no matter if it is adjustable won't cut it. I would also not recommend and rising rate fuel pressure regulator or 7th injector. I would recommend a AEM FIC6 to control the fuel and ignition. Its too bad you can't get a PCM retune.

[Zorm]

SilverXJ, why would you not recommend the 7th injector? Another question, would I really see any difference if my jeep will raley see more than 5k rpm?

[SilverXJ]

The Sc is not designed to run fuel through it. That is an old solution and there are more modern, better solutions.

[CobraMarty]

The Sc is not designed to run fuel through it. That is an old solution and there are more modern, better solutions.

And what are those design parameters of this SC verses others which can run fuel thru them?

[SilverXJ]

Running fuel through an Eaton can dissolve the rotor coatings, damage the seals and degrade the bearing lubricant.

[CobraMarty]

Whipple, except for their new kits, have been running fuel thru them for years, 20+, with no damage to coating, seals, or bearings/lubricant.
Eaton has carb. draw thru systems that put fuel thru their s/c.

Have you seen this damage, or is this just internet hearsay?
I guess spraying meth or water thru them is also bad?
What about PCV vapors, there is some gas component here, they are all plumbed to the inlet side of the s/c?

[SilverXJ]

You have a problem with Eaton's no fuel recommend policy, you can take it up with them. Stop harassing me with your ignorant and snide questions and comments.

Water/meth is a bit different that gas as is PCV vapors, which there isn't that much gas in PCV vapors. Combustion by products have a very small percentage of gas.

[Zorm]

hold on there cowboys, lets not get this into one of those CRAPPY threads. I can understand both sides, just cause some folks do it, does not mean the manufacture recommends it. Kinda like the speed limit, yes your car can do 190mph on the street but the gov't does not recommend it .

After I started this thread, I may be leaning towards a small turbo due to them "comming on" sooner then a SC. I still might get both of these SC though.

[CobraMarty]

Just saying...
Here is a 7th injector on a Tacoma Eaton SC kit, pre SC on an Eaton kit. IIRC that is the same MP90 SC you are planning to use.

http://urdusa.com/p1260518512/URD-7th-I ... _info.html
http://www.tacomaworld.com/forum/perfor ... boost.html

And other manufactures who put fuel thru their SC's.
http://www.jegs.com/p/Edelbrock/Edelbro ... 6/10002/-1
http://www.jegs.com/p/Weiand/Weiand-142 ... 3/10002/-1
http://www.jegs.com/p/Holley/Holley-142 ... 5/10002/-1

Can't find any info or memo about not being able to put fuel thru an Eaton SC. Enlighten us with facts, not internet hearsay.

[SilverXJ]

You can contact Eaton/Magnuson and get the same information I did. Go for it. I'm not wasting anymore time on your ignorant questions when all you wanted to do was refute what I say.


URD is also aftermarket. And we aren't talking about what Weiand or any other manufacture does. The thread is about an Eaton M90.

[CobraMarty]

So I emailed Eaton.....

To: Gwozdz, Barney, Customer Support,Technical Specialist
Phone# (248)226-6234 Fax# (248)226-6740
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]]
Subject: Re: Performance Products Question
Question:
Can you please help me. I am planning an installation/retrofit of one of your superchargers, not a current Gen 5 series, and want to be able to run fuel thru it with a 7th injector. I know that companies like URD and TRD used a 7th injector on their Tacoma Kit using your SC and run the fuel thru the SC and other companies have carburetor applications which draw thru the carb and have fuel go thru the SC. There are many internet horrors about putting fuel thru your Eaton SC like- "Running fuel through an Eaton can dissolve the rotor coatings, damage the seals and degrade the bearing lubricant". Is this true? Do I have to be concerned about this problem with your superchargers? Every other company with 'roots style/twin screw' non-centrifugal superchargers run fuel thru them with no ill effects. What is the real truth?
Thank you for your help.


Dear Mr. x,
Any type of liquid that runs through the rotor will eventually wear the coating off the blades. This will result in a lower amount of performance out of the blower.
Regards,
Barney Gwozdz, Customer Support, Technical Specialist
Phone# (248)226-6234 Fax# (248)226-6740
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]]


To: Gwozdz, Barney
Subject: Re: Performance Products Question

Thank you for your reply.

Would that also include water/methanol?
How much time would 'eventually wear (not dissolve) the coating off the blades'? months? years? 5-10years? 50,000miles?
Sorry for all the questions,

Thank you for your help.


From: [email protected]
Subject: RE: Performance Products Question
ANY liquid or gas more dense than O2. No way to tell on the mileage wear factor Sir.
Barney Gwozdz, Customer Support, Technical Specialist
Phone# (248)226-6234 Fax# (248)226-6740


Well that is vague at best.

"ANY liquid or gas more dense than O2" -- OK, so fuel, water, methanol, washer fluid, and PCV fumes
"will eventually wear the coating off the blades", "No way to tell on the mileage wear factor" -- That to me 'eventually' is a very long time.
"This will result in a lower amount of performance out of the blower" -- You will lose some blower efficiency and ? 1/2 pound boost?
and no mention about 'damage the seals and degrade the bearing lubricant'.

He didn't say you can't run fuel thru an Eaton Supercharger. It's not going to explode.
I searched the 'net' and haven't found any pictures of this or mention of this occurring.
If it is happening, it must be a very rare event.

My personal experience with running fuel and or water thru a 'lobe/rotor' type supercharger is that the cooling effect on the rotors will keep them from heating up and expanding and hitting the supercharger case and the liquid 'vaporization' intercooling effect is very effective in cooling the charge air temp a great amount.

[SilverXJ]

He didn't say you can't run fuel thru an Eaton Supercharger. It's not going to explode.

No one said you can't run fuel through a SC. Hell, you can run sand through it if you like. It is possible, just not recommended.

The Sc is not designed to run fuel through it. That is an old solution and there are more modern, better solutions.

As for the exploding, it is possible if the engine back fires through the intake.

My personal experience with running fuel and or water thru a 'lobe/rotor' type supercharger is that the cooling effect on the rotors will keep them from heating up and expanding and hitting the supercharger case

If that is happening there is another problem. Clearances are setup in supercharger with expansion taken into account, same as with piston to bore clearances.

[CobraMarty]

Good luck playing with your sand.

Just saying, I've seen more scored supercharger cases then rotors with the coating worn off.

Win-Win.