Crower "Beehive" springs (Ovate wire)

[lafrad]

Well, Switching gears a bit, I have decided against the Comp Cam beehive springs: http://www.jeepstrokers.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1413

and moved to the Crower Cams "Beehive" setup for the ford OHC... http://crower.com/pdf/2008b/166-180.pdf
Part number: 68193

The seat pressure is a bit high, but the spring rate is still relatively low, and pressure over the nose on a .450-.480 lift cam isn't significantly more than stock.
Still needs a cutter on the spring seat, turn the locater down a bit... but it can plug right into the stock retainers/locks, and can handle more lift than anything I will choose to throw at it...

I *may* look at cutting the seat to increase install height... lower the pressures a bit... anyone think THAT is worth it? (requires a second cutter...)

[lafrad]

Oh, BTW... you guys helped convince me of this move, along with finding a MUCH better price on the Crower stuff...

[SilverXJ]

Actually, the seat pressure should only be around 97 lbs, which is pretty good. The spring allows plenty of lift for most street applications. And you can reuse the stock locks and retainers? Sounds like a good deal there.

[lafrad]

I thought the stock install height was 1.640?


I better go measure the head again tomorrow...

[SilverXJ]

Oops.. it is 1.64. But I see where I went wrong. I was reading the heights backward on their chart. Now I see what you mean.. 140lbs is a bit high. Do you think you could have the head machined to get it to 1.75"?

[lafrad]

I was considering cutting the spring seats down 0.100" for the 1.750 install height...(that would give .650" possible lift on the spring!) but... it actually would cost quite a bit more... I have the tools to cut the diameter of the head locater down to the proper size, but it doesn't cut "wide" enough out for the spring to sit properly... so I would need ANOTHER tool, and probably some sort of stop so i dont' cut too far... lots and lots and lots of work

"Technically", seat pressure means nothing to the cam or valvetrain... the base circle only has pressure from the hydraulics, and the "ramps" all have a large radius to them, in theory able to handle much more pressure than the "nose" or maximum lift area of the cam. Since the spring pressure at max lift is within 10-15% of the stock springs on the stock cam, I'm going to take the chance that things up at that end will be all fine and nice.... and take advantage of the fact that the seat pressure is higher to reduce any chances of valve bounce...

[lafrad]

Alright... got the Crower Springs installed, and things look pretty good well, the setup does.
My work on the spring seats was definitely utilitarian.... doesn't look pretty but should get the job done.


#1 Exhaust installed




Left: Crower Spring & dodge Hemi retainer. Middle: Stock '99 Right: Mopar Performance stuff


Overview:

[lafrad]

Fully loaded:



Yea, no porting...

[SilverXJ]

Wow.. those are small. What height did you end up for the springs? Stock valves?

[amcinstaller]

they look taller than the stockers, but way way skinnier than the mopar performance ones. which rockers are you using with these? will this all fit under a stock valve cover with no spacers or funny hammer business? look good though for sure

[lafrad]

I used the seat cutter to increase the "Install" hight to ~1.700" with stock, triple groove valves. This puts the seat pressure at #124-#128. With the 0.450" lift cam, the pressure at the nose should be around #220. This means that the seat pressure is strong (much like the Mopar Performance springs) and the pressure over the nose at max lift is not much more than stock (for real!). Hoping to keep any chance of wiping a lobe out to an absolute minimum by keeping the max pressure on the sharp radius of the cam to stock levels.

Initially, I will be running stock rockers, and there will be no adjustments necessary to the valve-cover. Someday down the road I may "upgrade" to the 1.7rr. The springs themselves don't bind until a 1.035" compression height, giving me over 0.650" of lift before I start worrying about problems there...

Part Number: #68193
http://crower.com/pdf/2008b/166-180.pdf

[dwg86]

The Crower web site shows the retainers are for a 7mm valve stem. Did you use the stock Jeep 4.0 retainers on the 68193 springs? Crower web site shows $328.13 for a set of 16 springs. Is that what you paid?

[lafrad]

I am using a set of 2006 5.7L hemi retainers, using the stock, Jeep 3-groove locks (the Hemi Locks are the exact same mechanical 3-groove part also... I put them next to each-other an all measurements and looks and etc were the same).

If you want to get serious with this setup, there are Titanium retainers that are the same dimensions for the hemi (8mm locks, 3-groove keepers), and you can install with a stock valve-seat height for increased seat pressures (just shim it to get within your desired tolerance of coil bind)... and you have a superlight, rather strong spring setup that has no need for a damper.

I bought the springs individually and not for anywhere near that price.

[StroktWJ]

LSX Springs?

[lafrad]

Their target application is as an upgrade for Ford OHC 3V motors. Supposed to support higher lift/aggressive ramps and high RPM in those applications.

The jeep has a little bit more mass to the valvetrain,, (heavy hydraulic lifters) but it also is nowhere NEAR as harsh via ramp rates or RPM.