Jeep Strokers

Okay so I have a mix of parts for my stroker project:
1983 AMC pan
1989 block
1992 HO head
1992 exhaust
1996 throttle body
1999 intake


The exhaust is an AIR-injection delete, single piece but I believe I may need to swap it out for the 1999 dual header or modify it to account for my front differential mounting bracket when I get this thing assembled. The intake is incomplete. I know I need a fuel rail and ignition system from a Renix series engine but I have no idea what combination I'm looking for. I plan on going from an automatic to a manual gearbox if that makes any difference but I want to reuse my torqueflite until then. What fuel rail do I pull and what should I look for on the wiring harness? I notice these are plug and play. They aren't super bulky or long like my 258's harness. The sooner I get rid of it the better.

Seriously? No one here understands the basic assembly of a Jeep engine on a Jeep forum?

I am building a 4.7L from various parts necessary to fit the engine in my car as a simple drop-in. The dimensioning is already done. I currently need the correct wiring harness and electronics to get it started:
• the engine control module
• a compatible wiring harness
• a fuel rail that is easy to plumb on a 1999 Intake (stock was garbage)
• set of injectors that reflects compatibility for the Chrysler Sebring, Dodge Stratus and Plymouth Breeze

What years of XJ/MJ models are best for completing this project and what other library of information do I need to make it happen?

DaemonForce wrote:Okay so I have a mix of parts for my stroker project:
1983 AMC pan
1989 block
1992 HO head
1992 exhaust
1996 throttle body
1999 intake

1. Since the engine is going into your '83 Eagle, the '83 258 oil pan will do fine.
2. '89 Renix block = good choice. Any good 4.0L block would do regardless of year.
3. '92 HO head = also good choice. Again, any '91-'99 HO head would be fine.
4. '92 header = not the best 'cause they're crack prone. The WJ 4.0 or '00+ TJ/XJ header with expansion joints and dual outlet is probably best. You'll need the matching downpipe from the same Jeep model and you can replace the precats with straight pipe.
5. '96 throttle body = not the best choice because MAP sensor mounted to it. Better to get '91-'95 TB and use the firewall-mounted MAP sensor. The GM 1-bar MAP sensor is exactly the same so part is cheap and readily available.
6. '99+ intake = great choice. Use the return style fuel rail and 39psi regulator from a '91-'95 XJ or YJ. You'll also need fuel system and lines from a '91-'95 XJ or YJ.

I suggest you go for the OBD 1 ECU, wiring harness, and ignition system from a '91-'95 XJ or YJ rather than the Renix route. It'll ultimately be easier to set up and parts are more readily available in the junkyards. You can use a '96-'99 distributor that has the easily replaceable cam position sensor which is mounted right under the distributor cap. It plugs directly into the '91-'95 harness.
Injectors? That's a no brainer: Blue top Ford 24lb'ers (Ford Racing or 5.0L Cobra)

Cheromaniac wrote: The WJ 4.0 or '00+ TJ/XJ header with expansion joints and dual outlet is probably best.

There are no expansion joints in those manifolds (not headers). They are just two cast iron manifolds that don't mate up very well to 0730 and 6130 head ports.

5. '96 throttle body = not the best choice because MAP sensor mounted to it. Better to get '91-'95 TB and use the firewall-mounted MAP sensor. The GM 1-bar MAP sensor is exactly the same so part is cheap and readily available.

Map sensor can be moved and the port plugged if liked. I don't see a problem with the MAP sensor mounted to the TB to begin with.

I suggest you go for the OBD 1 ECU, wiring harness, and ignition system from a '91-'95 XJ or YJ rather than the Renix route.

If he has any intention of reprogram the PCM OBD II may be a better option. Slightly more emissions crap to deal with though.

Cheromaniac wrote:4. '92 header = not the best 'cause they're crack prone.

I'm not so worried about a cracking exhaust but I've considered the straight piece 99+ from the Grand Cherokee that I picked from last week. It looks good should this one fail. It's still an annoying grab because everything is so deeply recessed past the front of the firewall. It makes me wanna clobber whoever designed it. Oh and it's in the boneyard anyway so that lasted what? 15 years? Next! O_o The downpipe would be useful but since my Eagle has the wrong cat bolted up, I'm probably just going to straight pipe it anyway.

Cheromaniac wrote:5. '96 throttle body = not the best choice because MAP sensor mounted to it.

I really don't understand this but it seems like the most appropriate placement for the MAP sensor. Still unsure what problems I might face with this setup should I play around with LP or H.

Cheromaniac wrote:6. '99+ intake = great choice. Use the return style fuel rail and 39psi regulator from a '91-'95 XJ or YJ. You'll also need fuel system and lines from a '91-'95 XJ or YJ.

This is where it starts to get interesting. On every XJ I see the fuel uplink coming from under the driver side and mounted alongside the intake with a pot metal bracket and really high grade really annoying high pressure fuel line. The last time I successfully parted an intake from the fuel line, I had to bug a guy nearby for the 3/8" fuel line disconnect tool required to separate it from the fuel rail. I still don't have any of these but I know I'll definitely need one if I'm going to do this quickly. From all I can tell, O'Reilly and NAPA don't have these. From the Eagle, fuel uplink comes from the passenger side, into the mechanical fuel pump and plumbs directly into the Carter. The return line is plumbed to the antiquated charcoal canister. I have no idea what the regulator looks like. Should I pick an electrical pump from an XJ or buy an aftermarket unit?

Cheromaniac wrote:I suggest you go for the OBD 1 ECU, wiring harness, and ignition system from a '91-'95 XJ or YJ

It is NOT easier to setup. I'm fine with the ECU but the wiring harness and ignition system are a mixed bag. I need a minimal wiring design but I see the ignition system either temporarily stuck with the dated 258 distributor or some insane aftermarket arrangement that is still in the works. I know I'll need to pick a compatible ECU for reprogramming, that much I understand right now.

Cheromaniac wrote:and parts are more readily available in the junkyards. You can use a '96-'99 distributor that has the easily replaceable cam position sensor which is mounted right under the distributor cap. It plugs directly into the '91-'95 harness.

HAHAHAHAHAhA! Yeah, I'm going to go into Pick-n-Pull and find an AMC 6 with the distributor still bolted on. I completely gave up on that years ago. You must have a luck second to none. I would be extremely lucky to even find a junk distributor but they're almost always going to be junk. It would be nice to just pick up an MSD but I'd probably have to pull it apart and swap in some #925D springs and really check what's going on with this design(slightly paranoid). This part is like a massive fog of war.

Cheromaniac wrote:Injectors? That's a no brainer: Blue top Ford 24lb'ers (Ford Racing or 5.0L Cobra)

I'm completely lost on injectors since they're so completely foreign. These are color coded? I vaguely remember seeing light blue injectors on an XJ's intake that some military boys were wrenching on before I could get to them. :/

SilverXJ wrote:There are no expansion joints in those manifolds (not headers). They are just two cast iron manifolds that don't mate up very well to 0730 and 6130 head ports.

They're easier to remachine but I don't know if either will conflict with my differential bracket.

SilverXJ wrote:If he has any intention of reprogram the PCM OBD II may be a better option. Slightly more emissions crap to deal with though.

Screw the emissions noise, that's actually one of my main points for choosing this swap back when it was still a choice. Right now I just need to get the electronics to make it run. I feel like junking my Eagle's useless OBD I in favor of the Renix harness just to avoid rewiring my dash and the passenger side electronics that lead to the computer, wherever it is. I have the feeling that I'm going to end up doing this anyway but if there's any chance at making this easier, I'll stick with a bare Renix harness. I think I see them on the elusive MJ. If I decided to later put in the kind of accessories that come out of a Grand Cherokee like the overhead console, what all would I need to work on inside the cab?

SilverXJ wrote:There are no expansion joints in those manifolds (not headers). They are just two cast iron manifolds that don't mate up very well to 0730 and 6130 head ports.

You're right. It seems I got my headers mixed up 'cause I was thinking of this header which may actually be from a '96-'99 XJ/TJ/ZJ:

I really don't understand this but it seems like the most appropriate placement for the MAP sensor.

If you decide go for the OBD II system and wiring harness instead of OBD I, that would indeed be the case. If you were using an OBD I wiring harness, the plug for the MAP sensor wouldn't reach if the sensor is mounted to the TB.

HAHAHAHAHAhA! Yeah, I'm going to go into Pick-n-Pull and find an AMC 6 with the distributor still bolted on. I completely gave up on that years ago. You must have a luck second to none. I would be extremely lucky to even find a junk distributor but they're almost always going to be junk.

I didn't make it clear but was actually suggesting a new '96+ 4.0 OEM distributor, not a junker.
If you decide to go for the '96+ fuel system with a 49psi in-tank regulator, you could use Dodge Neon injectors.

YOU need to learn how to search and to loose the attitude.

Folks tend to be more helpful when someone shows at least a moderate amount of self help and positive attitude.

DaemonForce wrote: They're easier to remachine but I don't know if either will conflict with my differential bracket.

The interference is between the bottom of the port and the manifold. Its quite substantial. Yes, you could grind the manifold to make it line up better but either way the sealing surface at the bottom of the manifold is minimal.

Cheromaniac wrote:It seems I got my headers mixed up 'cause I was thinking of this header which may actually be from a '96-'99 XJ/TJ/ZJ

Yeah I think I've only seen that expanding manifold once. Everything else either resembles the single piece crack-prone manifold or the reinforced two piece welded as one unit that I found on a 99GC. Not fond of either one since they're a ridiculous chore to work around. I have no idea how I wrestled the 92 exhaust free from the head without scarring my hands.

Cheromaniac wrote:If you decide go for the OBD II system and wiring harness instead of OBD I, that would indeed be the case. If you were using an OBD I wiring harness, the plug for the MAP sensor wouldn't reach if the sensor is mounted to the TB.

At this point I am certain that the Renix harness is the most beneficial but I may possibly modify pieces of a harness from a 92-96 XJ to get rid of any possible clutter when handling some of the ignition electronics or extending parts of the existing harness to meet unexpected changes like MAP sensor location. At this point it's really just a matter of figuring out the pieces that I'll absolutely need.

Cheromaniac wrote:If you decide to go for the '96+ fuel system with a 49psi in-tank regulator, you could use Dodge Neon injectors.

In tank regulator? I don't think so. It's enough work just replacing the sending unit on this vehicle. An in-tank regulator is most likely out of the question but I know I'll have to address it soon. The guy that helped me with his fuel disconnect tool made a note that I should be looking for something with a pressure of 65psi. Is that right? I've been looking at a nice 40psi MSD fuel pump since early last year and the more I try to hunt down something of considerably higher spec, the more ridiculous the size and price. I'm probably better off just picking the OEM fuel pump electronics and trying my luck that way but there's still no ETA on when that gets started.

jsawduste wrote:YOU need to learn how to search and to loose the attitude.

I am engaged in a project that is outside of my skill level, outside my engineering class and far outside of my constantly growing negative budget as I'm being forced into a credit dance with rental cars $$$/day or my grandfather's 3 6000lb+ 5MPG pos from the Ford factory that constantly runs me out of money, out of gas, makes getting anywhere on time (usually 100+ miles away to garbage temp agencies and picking yards) completely impossible and runs me permanently insane with my family's constant nagging to get a new car, a new job (that I obviously can't hold) while still being their full time caretaker. This is a constant uphill battle that you obviously don't understand so your input is not needed. I am REALLY not in the mood to be fighting more nonsense that wastes my time, attention, energy and wealth.

DaemonForce wrote:Yeah I think I've only seen that expanding manifold once. Everything else either resembles the single piece crack-prone manifold or the reinforced two piece welded as one unit that I found on a 99GC.

a 99 WJ should have the two piece cast iron manifold. Sure it wasn't a 98 ZJ?

I am engaged in a project that is outside of my skill level, outside my engineering class and far outside of my constantly growing negative budget as I'm being forced into a credit dance with rental cars

If that is the case then I suggest not shooting down the majority of advice offered here. Since its outside your skill level its best to take advise from people in the know such as Cheromaniac and jsawduste.

SilverXJ wrote:Since its outside your skill level its best to take advise from people in the know such as Cheromaniac and jsawduste.

Don't forget to count yourself Chris.

DaemonForce wrote:I am engaged in a project that is outside of my skill level, outside my engineering class and far outside of my constantly growing negative budget

He he, join the club. Many of us have been there, done that, and had our fingers burnt along the way too.
You've taken on a project that's daunting even for a skilled professional especially as you're trying to build a Frankenstein's monster out of parts from different years/models. All we can do is try to help you achieve your goal by making the build as simple as possible to keep costs to a minimum.