Gradon's Stroker Project

[gradon]

Today I picked up the pistons from AA. Spent a little over an hour taking the bottom end apart with Nick's help. We then took the pistons, rods, rings, block, cam bearings, and crank to the machinist. He measured the crank and the tolerances are good(I took a copy of the engine specs, but he had the info in his database as well), so I then went to AA and ordered the standard size main and rod bearings. We then removed the small downpipe on Andrew's 93XJ(I got him hooked up from an acquaintance of mine: black and gold w/tan interior 2dr 2wd ax15, 4.0 143K--$600 and runs good) and installed the bigger downpipe from the 96+(might have started earlier, but dunno; got it for $5.66 at the JY) after we heated up the factory crunch and banged it out round. He already has my older magnaflow cat and a Dynomax catback, so the downpipe was the major restriction in the exhaust flow. I'll give him the 99+ intake manifold that will come off the 96 tomorrow and he'll pickup a less restrictive intake(maybe I'll give him my K&N, cause I want the Amsoil nano-fiber cone #3090). Anyhow, I took the header panel off my 96, removed the busted radiator mount and bolted in the one I got from the JY. Since I had the header panel off, I used an angle grinder and removed a lot of metal behind the driver's side headlight(I'll try to get a pic tomorrow) so that more fresh air can get to the filter. Tomorrow I'll remove the engine and tranny and maybe get those valves and springs installed on the head if I make it to AA to rent the compressor. I also need to clean up some of the welds on the Borla header with a grinder, since I noticed them the last time it was off.

[gradon]

So today we removed the engine and tranny. I didn't like the throw-out bearing so I had to order another one($36 w/ discount). Nick cut the mech fan shroud tabs off and re-welded them so that the second e-fan will fit in there as if it came from the factory(sweet). One of the motor mounts were cracked, so I had to get two of the AA ones(another $40 for both)--I'm sure they're not as good as the Brown Doggs or those other nice ones, but they'll have to do. I'm only yanking the distributor/cap/and wires from the 96 block, so that'll be on standby indefinitely in case anything goes wrong. I duct taped all exposed valve cover, intake/exhaust ports, distributor, and cooling holes to keep the elements and bugs out. I then went to the machine shop to check the status of the block. It was already cleaned, bored, decked, and cam bearings pressed in--very nice. He wanted me to return with the cam to verify alignment of bearings and also the old pistons w/ rods so that he could press the rods on the pistons in the right direction. He said I can pick the block and pistons up tomorrow morning @9. Tacho is very thorough and I'm sure I will be recommending him to others in the future. Money well spent. Anyhow I have a half tank of 87 that I need to get out(Nick recommended buying octane booster tablets?). I want to get at least $20 of 93 in there so that I can perform the 20-30mins of 2-2.5K rpm cam break-in. I left the brad penn 30wt break-in oil at my house(25 min away) so I guess I have to get over there tomorrow(I've been crashing at my parent's house a lot these past two weeks since Nick has been back). Anyhow he leaves on Friday morning, so hopefully all goes well tomorrow. I don't think we'll get around to tuning the PSC1, so hopefully the stock programming can compensate. I'm sure we'll find out real quick if those 23.2#ers will cut it until I decide on the FMS or LT-1s. The Innovate LM-2 still hasn't been released(I don't have the funds for that yet anyways), so it won't be dialed in for a month probably. Anyhow it came down to the wire with the timing of everything, but it looks like tomorrow will be a good day.

[gradon]

So I picked up everything at the machine shop(except the rings, so I have to go back). He had forgotten to lathe down the crank spacer, so I got to watch him use a dial indicator to make sure it was square in the vise--very cool. While he was cutting the spacer, I noticed two pistons on the shelf. At first I thought they were the two I dropped off so that he could see what direction to press the rods onto the pistons. They weren't. They were two 677p standard bore pistons. I compared one to one of my 825cp30s and THEY HAVE THE EXACT SAME DISH! This now means that all the sealed power pistons have a dish depth of .116" and 17.5cc--what someone said a magazine article(can anyone help me figure out if it was a post here or NAXJA?) claimed a couple months ago. I'll give federal mogul a call to verify tomorrow. This means that I'm out of the red with the compression ratios--9.84 SCR and 8.4:1 DCR(instead of 10.08:1 and 8.61:1 if they were 15.1cc dishes--whew!) Anyhow, total charge for dip, deck .030", bore and hone .030", press in cam bearings, press pistons to rods, and lathe the spacer--$430. I'm on lunch break and have to get back to work.

[Flash]

Don't count you chicken until you get that piston in the bore,and attached to the crank, and see how much piston to deck hight you have!


Flash

[John]

Gradon, I think this is the article you were looking for. http://www.fourwheeler.com/techarticles ... index.html
John

[gradon]

Thanks John--that was the article I was talking about. So basically the h825cp(standard) and h802cp(metric) are higher end models of the 677 since they are hyperteutic and have the coated skirts standard(the 677cp has them as well). They have the same shape .116" deep dish of 17.5cc, but have different pin heights(?). I'll have to give federal mogul a call to verify the info and then get back to you so that the faqs can be changed(again). Now that article said that the area above the rings is an additional 1.3ccs so they claimed a measured 18.8cc piston dish volume. Anyhow, I haven't posted much since Nick and I attacked the stroker build on Thursday and have the internals all bolted in. We were forced to stop(@4am fri morning--12 hours into the build) due to having the wrong pilot bushing/bearing. I bought one for a 94 xj with the ax-15. The external diameter of that bearing is too small(by 1/16-1/8"), so it wasn't able to be pressed into the crank. Tomorrow my brother Andrew is going to help me find/order one that will fit(supposedly there is a universal bearing that will work). I don't know if Nick took any pictures of the block, but he did snap some shots of the metal behind the driver's side headlight that I cut out to let the cone get more fresh air. He also took some shots of his weld job on the relocated tabs for the second stock e-fan that will be going in there. I wanted him to hear it start up in person(he left @ 9:30 on friday), but at least he got to be a major part of the build. It was amazing how many parts were Federal Mogul and I hand picked a lot of the Mopar parts. Anyhow, it's late and hopefully I'll get to start her up tomorrow.

[gradon]

So I got a pilot bushing(not bearing) that worked today--I'll give the part number tomorrow--$3 from AA. I just got done dropping the engine and tranny in, bolting up the ac, the exhaust manifold, the intake manifold, the downpipe, and the driveshaft. Tomorrow I'll finish up with the rest--p/s pump, smaller belt, wire up the 2nd e-fan, radiator, header panel, connect all electric, fill tranny and put shifter back on, fill block and prime it. I'll see if I have to cut the tabs off the distro, but hopefully the mopar cam hashes better than the other brands. I still have a half tank of 87, so I'll have to get some of that 6 pt octane booster and also fill w/ 5 gallons of 93. I'll start it w/o the Jet 2 installed(keep that advance out of the equation to begin with) and see how the stock programming and injectors like the higher compression.

[John]

IIRC I used a shortened pilot bushing for a 76 CJ7 to marry a ax15 to a 12 weight crankshaft.

Piston volumes, I think the volumes have changed on some of these pistons dishes. Some information also is taken with the piston/rings in the bore to provide volume information including space to the top ring, some data is taken with a cover over the piston dish only. Apples and raisins..........
Any updated information will be greatly valued. Ask how their info is measured.
John

[gradon]

So where yesterday was the day for tracking down the right bushing, today was the day for tracking down the right belt--2045K6. Anyhow got the stroker started up--took her to 2K and five minutes into it, she was starting to overheat. I had to fill the radiator up more and connected the 2nd fan directly to the battery(I''ll get the temp switch connected tomorrow). I restarted her and then kept it at 2K for 25 minutes. At first the oil pressure was 75psi, but eventually it made it's way down to 45psi, and then when I cut her off, it was 22psi at idle. It was noisy at first, but then gradually got quieter. It still hasn't hit me yet, probably because I've been working non-stop since Thursday(with Fri and Sat doing 20hrs of landscaping for a good co-worker at the club), but if all goes well on the first road test, then I'm sure I'll be excited. I couldn't have asked for better weather and it truly was a Memorial Day for me.

[John]

Sounds like you had trapped air in the coolant system. These motors do that very well, Did you read my aspirin tip for preventing this? Keep a eye on coolant for another run or so. Sounds like a fine start up. Look forward to hearing about further good adventures.
John

[nick]

Well since my bro hasn't put up any pictures I'll put up some for him. Would have been nice to hear it start up before I left but what can you do. Enjoy!

Ready to pull engine











Fresh block ready for the guts. Unfortunately I never took any pics with the guts in it







Gradon opened cut up the right portion of frame behind head light for more air to get to the K&N cold air intake.




And for anyone wanting to follow the cutting and welding of the fan tabs for an extra e-fan heres how I did it for Gradon.

[Flash]

Thanks nick,
And welcome to Jeep Strokers


Flash.

[nick]

Thanks Flash, but you don't need to welcome me here. I've known about Jeep Strokers from its inception. I've also been on the srokers yahoo group for a years, just didn't get an account here as I don't post much because I don't have time. I'll consider my stroker when I get out of the military. Right now its helping out my bro and he's doing well now that he has gotten the major part done. Now he needs to fine tune with the wide band O2 sensor and PC-1 piggy back.

[John]

It may not be necessary to welcome you here, but how about, good to hear from you. Keep in touch.
John

[gradon]

I posted last night but must've hit save instead of submit. I drove the stroker yesterday and there is a noise coming from the tranny so I got to drop it. IMO it is either the pilot bushing(ID too big?) or the input shaft bearing. Besides the noise, the tranny shifts awesomely, so it's not the clutch/pressure plate, or throw-out bearing. The noise is there in 4th, which should go away if it was the input shaft bearing, although if I hold the shifter firmly to the left or right the noise goes away. Anyhow, before I picked this bushing, the PB77HD, (there were no bearings w/ ~1.06"OD and .75"ID) my other option was a having a bearing w/ 1.8"OD and .75"ID machined down to 1.06", so I might need to stop by Tacho's again(or give hesco a call, cause they probably have one). The PB77HD sticks out of the crank an 1/8", so I don't know if that is a problem(John mentioned a "shortened" bushing he used--?)This isn't the 96 tranny that I pulled out, as that is on standby along with the 96 longblock, so if it is the input shaft bearing, I can swap the other one in. Yesterday I got the 2nd e-fan temp switch wired in. It'll cut on @195 and will stay on after the XJ is turned off until it gets below that temp. The engine still is running a bit hot while sitting at stop lights, due to tight clearances and not being broken in, but I can always turn the defroster or AC on to get the 1st e-fan to kick on and the temps drop back down. I also put the Jet2 chip back in and there was no pinging. I didn't really push it due to the tranny, so I'll see in an hour or so what the deal is when I drop it. The exhaust note is a little deeper and definitely unique(Borla is worth it guys--I have had this setup for 3-4 years and it still is in great condition). The good news is that the engine is good and I don't have to take it out. The biggest pain in taking out the tranny is removing the shifter, and the plate underneath and then lowering the cross member a little to get to those two star bolts on top. At least mine's a 2wd so I don't have to remove a front drive shaft or deal with the added weight of the transfer case. More later.