DasFrogger's 96 xj stroker build

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SilverXJ
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Re: DasFrogger's 96 xj stroker build

Post by SilverXJ »

It does sound valve train related. Could be a loose rocker arm, lack of preload, bent pushrod, or something else. Pull the valve cover and inspect. If it is a lifter it could be one that is damaged on the foot at which point the cam would have to be replaced. It could also have been a lifter that has been assembled wrong or is missing parts. In that case you can replace the parts from a new one and ship another cam break in or just swap out the lifter. I have had two Comp am lifters missing part.
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Re: DasFrogger's 96 xj stroker build

Post by dasfrogger »

Pulled the valve cover and everything looked good on the top end, but not getting the amount of oil into the rockers as expected. Tried running some ATF in the oil to free any stuck lifters, and it had marginal results on some lifters. Drained oil and pulled oil pan to check bottom end. Bearings and pistons look good.

I've ordered new lifters (Hylift A-2011's per your previous rec on another thread), MLS Gasket, Head bolts, etc etc to swap out (hopefully) this weekend. With any luck the lifters we remove won't look bad and I won't have to change the cam.

Hopefully We'll be back on the road soon! Thanks again for the advice!
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Re: DasFrogger's 96 xj stroker build

Post by dasfrogger »

After tearing everything apart and prepping the surfaces, we went to remove the old lifters and install new ones.We were looking thru the block to inspect the cam from above (we'd just looked from below) and found all this junk...Looks like my machine shop did a terrible job with cleaning and prepping the block. I don't know how we missed it, but it had to be left over from the original motor - I didn't even run the motor more than 200 miles.

Image
Image

So after cleaning the crap out of the block, and being satisfied that the cam was ok ( lobes looked good, old lifter bottoms looked good too) we proceeded with putting everything back together with all new parts. After about 12 hours over 4 nights last week we're ready to fire it up. Moment of truth...

https://youtu.be/ivymYBxaXS8


And it's garbage. The issue persists, it was not the lifters. Likely a seized wrist pin or maybe even bad cam bearings. Either way, the motor has to come out again and get torn down to find out and fix it. If it's a wrist pin, hopefully Clegg will do the right thing and take care of the situation since they pressed the pistons on to the recon'd rods. If it's the cam bearing I may be up a creek as my machinist shop's policies don't give me a lot of hope.

I don't really know how to feel about this right now. I'm pissed that i didn't just buy a hesco in the first place - i remember thinking, "sure it's a lot more money, but it has a warranty and i'll be back on the road faster". I'm pissed because I love this jeep, but don't know if i can afford to spend more time and money on it.
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Re: DasFrogger's 96 xj stroker build

Post by nicpaige »

What is all that crap you pulled out of your motor? Is it gritty? Almost looks like sand. If that material has any hard particles and it made its way through your oil system your bearings are probably fubar. Hope not. Did your machine shop assemble the short block? If not you should ALWAYS clean it yourself no matter what they say.
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Re: DasFrogger's 96 xj stroker build

Post by Jeeper2017 »

nice! any updates on this build?
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Re: DasFrogger's 96 xj stroker build

Post by dasfrogger »

Jeeper2017 wrote:nice! any updates on this build?
Oh man....This project has been an absolute nightmare.

I think things were left off after we replaced lifters/headgasket/etc for a 2nd time and didn't solve the problem.

We pulled the motor apart and found that the #6 wrist pin had seized, digging the piston into the wall of the cyl head. After some measuring and investigating it was found that the machine shop ignored my directions & the directions from the pisotn manufacuturer and bored the cyls a little too small and when they heated up it caused the pins to sieze.

Took the motor back to the machine shop and they told me they did everything right - despite taking measurements and confirming they were smaller than what was requested. the double talk was incredible. They offered zero assistance - no refund, no redo of job (not that i wanted them to touch it anyway...), no nothing. So I took it to another shop and had them rebuild again. Luickly they could re use some parts. they had to bore .050 to get past the damage from the piston, but everything got back together.

While the new machine shop had the motor, I figured we should replace everything else. We did suspension, brakes, steering knuckles, rebuilt axles, etc. Pretty much everything under the car. After way too long we got that job done and the motor back in the car (our fault not new machine shop). During break in we couldn't get it to idle quite right. This is where the electrical gremlins happened:

Both O2 sensors had fried. The connections in the injector harness had started to wear (thanks chrysler) and we had to rebuild the harness. Something was wrong with the computer (at this point i can't even remember) and we installed a replacement. Replaced crank position sensor again. Plugs, Plug wires, dizzy cap (again). One thing would break, we'd fix it, then another would break. Finally we found out that the NEW distributor fell apart internally and was causing problems (was in tact in the beginnig). Replaced with another dizzy, problem goes away, but now it's back intermittantly. After months of chasing we still haven't pinpointed what's going on. I'm thinking of going mega jolt/edis to eliminate the garbage dizzy, but don't want to do any more non stock mods and add more complexity to this system. Does MSD make a dizzy for our motor? i haven't seen anything....

In the brief period when it was back together and running well enough the transmission went out. Ordered a reman trans and new torque converter. Installed, drove for a bit (during quite phase of electrical gremlins) and it wasn't quite right. Foudn out the trans wasn't engaging 4th gear. A few miles later it starts downshifting then immediately upshifting randomly. Troubleshoot with Trans rebuilder, then pull box and return. Freshly rebuilt box comes back, actually the jeeps original trans, and gets installed. Everything seems to be good. Gremlins seem to be gone. I go ahead and put new tires on it as the old ones were dry rotted and have the headliner fixed. I feel like the end is in sight.

Now the brake M/C is leaking into the booster. Lets replace that. Why not go ahead and throw on some exhaust parts into that order. Install new exhaust.

Then the electrical gremlins come back. See above. Also, there is a mysterious "clunk" coming from the rear end.

On top of all that The new waterpump puked its guts out last week. Replaced it and now it wants to get hot, won't regulate temp. Going to replace the thermostat for the 3rd time since rebuild. Hopefully that fixes it.

That's just what i remember at this point. There is more, so much more that has gone wrong with this project. This project has just been a wild goose chase. Fix one thing, another thing breaks. Fix that thing the first thing breaks. It's past the point of making sense to keep fixing things, but there is too much money tied up in it to just abandon the project. So more money gets dumped in. Deadline after deadline missed for a variety of reasons.

This Jeep is my albatros.

I just want to drive my jeep.

I'm not sure that i ever will again. Thats not hyperbole - I am slowly losing hope that this thing will actually get fixed and I'll be able to enjoy it for any significant length of time. Something else will break. It'll be back in the shop taking up more time and money.

I cling to really fond memories of driving my first XJ. And the time and trips i took with my grandmother in this one. I want that happiness again, but its always just out of grasp. We will get there eventually. And it'll be great.
Jake
96 Cherokee Country 4.6L Stroker
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Re: DasFrogger's 96 xj stroker build

Post by dasfrogger »

Update:

Best we can tell the over heating issue is a lack of airflow problem. Only happens when the ambient temp is very high. Going to upgrade the stock electric & Mechanical fans to twin electric fans with an automatic fan control and hope that does the job.

Rear end is going to get a fluid flush and maybe the wheel bearings replaced. We haven't rebuilt it yet and i'd like to leave it in the car if possible and rebuild later on down the line.

Missfire has cleared up. Currently running aftermarket (autozone/cardone/whatever) garbage dizzy housing with OEM sensor and it's doing ok. If the issue comes back we're going to go full stand alone haltech.
Jake
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Re: DasFrogger's 96 xj stroker build

Post by SkylinesSuck »

Doesn't necessarily sound like airflow to me. Overheating when not moving, but fine when driving is airflow. Does it do that?
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Re: DasFrogger's 96 xj stroker build

Post by dasfrogger »

The overheat happens when moving too.
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Re: DasFrogger's 96 xj stroker build

Post by SkylinesSuck »

Not air flow then. Bigger/better radiator or find a possible issue causing too much heat i.e. timing, fuel, or lack of coolant flow.
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Re: DasFrogger's 96 xj stroker build

Post by SkylinesSuck »

Oh man, I just reread the whole thread. What an ordeal man. Sorry for your troubles. I sure hope you do what you can to go after that first machine shop.

So this overheating all started with the replacement of the water pump, correct? What pump did you put on it?
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Re: DasFrogger's 96 xj stroker build

Post by dasfrogger »

So, I'm not sure that the water pump actually failed. I'd like to believe that it did, but I don't have any physical evidence for that or other issues.

Thanks to my lack of free time, I left the jeep at a friends shop who had been helping me with the build prior. Its come to light that he'd been stalling and canceling 'appointments' to meet because he hadn't actually done some of the work he'd said he did. A lot of things did get done, but several others didn't. At this point, i'm not really sure what was and wasn't done and need find time to get under the jeep and poke around. It was a dissapointing situation, but I'm moving on and will stay friendly.

So, at this point the Jeep is back in my posession. Seems to drive pretty well, with a few exceptions.

When idling the jeep will randomly shut off cold. Friend thinks its the autozone Cam position sensor and I've got a MOPAR replacement to swap out.
There is a bit of a noise in the driveline somewhere. Only noticeable at idle & sounds rotational. Need to investigate soon.
No 4wd. before picking it up friend told me he was hearing a 'pop' in the drive line. Supposedly rebuild the rear end with no success in resolving noise. Then pulled the front drive shaft and the issue went away. Thinks its the slip yolk that has gone bad and rec rebuilding the transfer case and installing a SYE. Not sure why there would be any noise from the front d/s when in 2wd. Will probably reinstall the front driveshaft to diagnose myself before dropping coin on the SYE Kit.
Headliner is still out - was supposed to be replaced by a bodyshop he was affiliated with 4 months ago.
There are half a dozen other little things to complete.

Otherwise everything seems good. Changed oil with Rotella T6 5w40 and a WIX filter. new tires and alignment have made a huge difference. Temp stays under 210 even on 90 degree days. AC is ice cold.

So I've still got plenty of work to do and not a lot of spare time. I'm going to spend the little time I've got getting it back to baseline and regaining trust and confidence in this machine.
Jake
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Re: DasFrogger's 96 xj stroker build

Post by dasfrogger »

It's been awhile and i haven't gotten much farther with the jeep.

Still having the stalling issue. We pulled the trans again to fix a stripped bolt holding the Crank position sensor in place to eliminate that as the culprit. The problem still occurs with the same frequency. I'm thinking that it might be the PCM. I've heard they can start to go bad and cause intermittent stall issues and bad idle. I've got both of those symptoms, so i need to find a reputable PCM rebuilder. Anyone have any recommendations?

turns out the jeep didn't have anything wrong with the transfer case and didn't need a SYE. More lies from a supposed friend.

Just changed the oil again and sent off a sample to blackstone oil analysis. Hoping for good results. Right before i changed it, the Oil pressure gauge started going nuts. I swapped for some 10w30 this time and its back to being happy. I don't know if the sender went bad, or if the pressure relief in the oil filter failed, or if there is something more sinister going on in the engine. Time will tell.
Jake
96 Cherokee Country 4.6L Stroker
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