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Stroker vs V8 swap

Posted: January 25th, 2019, 7:37 am
by Andre_ITALY
Hi everybody!
I planning to modify my 1997 TJ 4.0 m/t, and i need to understand the "stroker result" VS V8 swap. :huh:

V8 for comparison:

1997-98 ZJ 318 (5.2)
1998 ZJ 360 (5.9)
1999-2004 WJ 4.7
2002-2004 WJ 4.7 HO

Exaple: For a stroker with similar/little bit superior performance of ZJ 318, what should I do? Budget for this Stroker ?


Thanks a lot! :cheers: :banana:

Re: Stroker vs V8 swap

Posted: January 25th, 2019, 1:12 pm
by TJryder
Stroker all day long. Omho.

Unless you put in SBC stroker with 350+ HP.

And paperwork here in EU will kill you. With stroker you will be street legal.

Re: Stroker vs V8 swap

Posted: January 25th, 2019, 10:38 pm
by lazyxj
TJryder wrote:
January 25th, 2019, 1:12 pm
Stroker all day long. Omho.
And paperwork here in EU will kill you. With stroker you will be street legal.
The paper work here in California can kill you too.
While you can get more horsepower out of a V8, the hassle involved isn't worth it, IMO.
Installing a stroker is a weekend job with a friend's help, a V8 conversion can take months and a lot of visits from the UPS man.
Check Novac's site for their V8 XJ conversions to get an idea of what needs to be switched and decide if you are up for the challenge.
It's tempting and I gave it some thought.
https://www.novak-adapt.com
A stroker is visually the same as a stock 4.0. The only big differences is the exhaust and throttle bodies, assuming you will install headers and a bigger throttle body. I doubt if any inspector is sharp enough to spot a bigger throttle body and the Banks header isn't very noticeable and it has a CARB registration number, meaning it's street legal in California. The EU may accept CARB's stringent standards.
With a stroker, you wouldn't have to import as many parts. Once done, since you still have a Jeep engine, availability to normal repair parts remains the same.
The number one advantage of a stoker, if you live in an emission's control region, is the lack of paper work, since it's the same engine, literally if you rebuild your existing engine.
With the right cam and injectors, it will pass a tail pipe test. My 2001 stroker passes the ECM's internal checks, meaning the emissions are low enough that the computer is happy and it will pass an emissions tests, as long as it also passes the visual inspection.
Being an air breathing creature, I have no issues with the emission requirements.

Re: Stroker vs V8 swap

Posted: January 26th, 2019, 12:01 am
by Cheromaniac
Andre, none of the V8 engines you mentioned produce enough power in stock form to make them better than a 4.6L stroker build. The only V8 swap even remotely worth doing is the Chevy LS series, but that's a non-starter with you living in Italy.
I suggest you contact Russ Pottenger so he can put together a parts list for you to do a stroker build. Then you can have everything shipped together in one big box, and that'll cost a lot less than shipping individual parts in smaller boxes. You may want to read about my own stroker build (link in sig) to get a better idea of what's involved.
It's probably a good idea to find a decent junkyard 4.0L engine to use for the stroker build and have that ready to swap into your Jeep. This will minimize downtime and you can keep your old 4.0L engine as a spare.

Re: Stroker vs V8 swap

Posted: February 1st, 2019, 11:03 am
by Andre_ITALY
Sorry! I did not explain well. :worship: :doh:

I know the legal advantages of a stroker vs v8 swap. A Stroker will be my way I'm not planning a v8 swap :nono: .
My jeep is like a DD, not a "trailer queen".
Here in Italy, if you want a "faster but cheaper" TJ, put a 5.2-5.9 (ZJ)or 4.7 (WJ) because is easy to find a donor for less than 1000 (and all parts from USA, will cost x2, for shipping and tax).
My question was about the performance result vs budget because a Stroker is like a custom dress, the budget is very variable from "4.6 poor man's" stroker to a 5.0L "very high-buck stroker".
http://www.jeep4.0performance.4mg.com/stroker.html
example:
A TJ with a 4.6L "poor man's" stroker VS a TJ with a 5.9 zj result faster on 0-60 mph and 1/4 mile? And for offroad use/rock crawling, torque curve, throttle response, and rev fast is batter on 4.6L "poor man's" stroker? Or need more budget for my goal.

thank you so much! :worship: :worship: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers:

Re: Stroker vs V8 swap

Posted: February 2nd, 2019, 1:26 am
by Cheromaniac
If you're on a limited budget, do the modified poor man's stroker. At 245hp/315lbft (with CAI, 62mm TB, header, 2.5" exhaust), it'll have all the power you'll need to have fun in your TJ.

Re: Stroker vs V8 swap

Posted: February 3rd, 2019, 4:25 am
by TJryder
Hi Andre,

Donors do come cheap - but questionable.

Most ov them spend their last hours as bashers and people do god knows what to them.

Do not be fooled that a donnor engine will be without issues or without need for rebuild.

I have put some classic and toy cars through my hands in my life. The cheapest option always ends up to be the most expensive in the end.

Contact Russ for your parts, find a donor TJ engine, build it, swap it and sell the fully running 4.0 for a reasonable price.

IMHO that is the cheapest way, total budget with deducrion of running engine will be arround 2.500€.

That is for nicelly built, street legal, reliable, almost standard rig @260-270hp.

Which adds to resale value in Europe, the V8 swap will reduce your resale value...

BR M

Re: Stroker vs V8 swap

Posted: February 3rd, 2019, 8:07 am
by Cheromaniac
Not to mention that if you have a big displacement engine with high CO2 emissions, you're likely to be clobbered in Europe with high annual vehicle licence charges. Ask me how I know!

Re: Stroker vs V8 swap

Posted: February 4th, 2019, 2:38 am
by Andre_ITALY
Cheromaniac wrote:
February 2nd, 2019, 1:26 am
If you're on a limited budget, do the modified poor man's stroker. At 245hp/315lbft (with CAI, 62mm TB, header, 2.5" exhaust), it'll have all the power you'll need to have fun in your TJ.
CAI? what is it? :huh:

Actualy i have a 62mm TB ( BBK), 505 performance SS fully ported header , Magnaflow catalytic converter, borla 2.5" catback and BMC CDA airfilfer(w/safari snorkel)

Re: Stroker vs V8 swap

Posted: February 4th, 2019, 4:58 am
by SkylinesSuck
Cold Air Intake

Re: Stroker vs V8 swap

Posted: February 4th, 2019, 9:53 am
by Cheromaniac
Andre_ITALY wrote:
February 4th, 2019, 2:38 am
CAI? what is it? :huh:

Actualy i have a 62mm TB ( BBK), 505 performance SS fully ported header , Magnaflow catalytic converter, borla 2.5" catback and BMC CDA airfilfer(w/safari snorkel)
CAI = Cold Air Intake. Many are advertised as cold air intakes but because they have filters that are exposed in the engine compartment, they actually function as hot air intakes. The best ones have large diameter tubing, a big conical filter (S&B are the best), and a heatshield that isolates the filter from hot underhood air.

Looks like you already have the external bolt-ons required to take advantage of a stroker build.
If you decide to proceed with the modified poor man's stroker (specs below), the list of non-OEM parts you'll need to ship from overseas will be very short.

4.6L Modified "poor man's" stroker

Jeep 4.2L 3.895" stroke crank
Jeep 4.0L 6.125" rods
Custom forged +0.020" bore pistons, compression height 1.380", dish volume 26cc
9.25:1 CR
Stock 4.0 camshaft
DIY ported HO 1.91"/1.50" 57cc cylinder head
Mopar/Victor 0.043" head gasket
0.043" quench height
Bosch 0280155703 injectors for '96-'04 engines
245hp @ 4700rpm, 315lbft @ 3000rpm ('96-'04 camshaft)

Re: Stroker vs V8 swap

Posted: February 21st, 2019, 8:31 am
by Andre_ITALY
Cheromaniac wrote:
February 4th, 2019, 9:53 am

4.6L Modified "poor man's" stroker

Jeep 4.2L 3.895" stroke crank
Jeep 4.0L 6.125" rods
Custom forged +0.020" bore pistons, compression height 1.380", dish volume 26cc
9.25:1 CR
Stock 4.0 camshaft
DIY ported HO 1.91"/1.50" 57cc cylinder head
Mopar/Victor 0.043" head gasket
0.043" quench height
Bosch 0280155703 injectors for '96-'04 engines
245hp @ 4700rpm, 315lbft @ 3000rpm ('96-'04 camshaft)
What effects will it have on torque, power and mpg this stuff? :?: (My 1997 Tj run 4.88 and 35"x12.50r15 BFG)
- Russ Ported HO 2.00"/1.55" 62cc cylinder head vs DIY ported HO 1.91"/1.50" 57cc cylinder head
- A camshaft like a compcams 68-232-4 (or Russ custom) vs 96-'04 camshaft
- 99&UP intake manifold vs 1997 manifold?
- 70mm TB instead of my 62mm TB?
- higher CR?
- 4CW vs 12CW crankshaft?

Remember this: european unleaded fuel type in 95 RON (standard) or 100 RON (Premium).
For conversion in US system : http://www.pencilgeek.org/2009/05/octan ... sions.html



:cheers:

Re: Stroker vs V8 swap

Posted: February 21st, 2019, 10:55 pm
by Cheromaniac
Your engine will make more power and torque with Russ' ported head, Russ' custom 68-232-4 cam, a 70mm TB, and a higher CR. It'll be close to this:

4.6L low-buck stroker

Jeep 4.2L 3.895" stroke crank
Jeep 4.0L 6.125" rods
Custom forged +0.030" bore pistons, compression height 1.380", dish volume 18cc
9.6:1 CR
CompCams 68-231-4 206/214 degree camshaft
Russ Pottenger ported HO 2.00"/1.55" 62cc cylinder head
Mopar/Victor 0.043" head gasket
0.043" quench height
Ford 24lb/hr injectors for '96-'04 engines
268hp @ 4900rpm, 326lbft @ 3500rpm